The Thirteenth House
Jan. 11th, 2011 10:28 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
peroxidepirateI finished The Thirteenth House! Today I'm heading back to the library in search of the next one.
I certainly enjoyed it, but I didn't find it nearly as compelling as I did Mystic and Rider. I guess that's a given, really: I like Kirra, but she's not Senneth.
(Sidebar: right now, at least, I love Senneth more than any other character, ever. Clearly a reread -- or audio-book listen? -- of Mystic and Rider is in order, and then maybe I'll write more about her. But first I would like to read the third and fourth books, at least, so I know what else happens!)
I also don't find Romar Brendyn all that interesting, and for most of the book, I don't have a lot of sympathy for his and Kirra's star-crossed love. I'm intrigued by the other parts of the story -- Amalie and Valri are fascinating; so are Cammon and Justin. The political situation is fascinating, too, which is a testament to Shinn's writing ability (since I don't even care much about politics in real life, sadly). I miss Donnal's presence through most of the book -- both after he "leaves" and before, when he's there but Kirra's not paying attention to him -- but as a storytelling device, his absence is perfect.
Back to the romance angle: I spent the first part of the book thinking that maybe I just don't understand because I haven't been there; I've never met someone and fallen quickly and intensely in love despite Reasons for it not to work. I've been in love -- I think -- but it was a gradual thing that built from knowing someone for a long time and getting slowly closer. And I'm still not sure that's the in love that changes people's lives.
Once Kirra and Romar start sleeping together, there's some "I don't care about reputation/my wife/the fate of kingdom, I only want you," which made me angry at them both. In the background I was also thinking, "Maybe I don't want that -- ever. Maybe I wouldn't be cut out for this love thing."
Enter Tayse, telling Kirra that if she really loves Romar, her first priority should be to protect him, even if that means staying away from him.
Because, yeah, there are different ways of being in love. Different ways of expressing that love.
And I'm not a "be together at all costs" type; I'm a "look at the big picture, act for the greater good, suffer in silence if necessary" type (so possibly I can write Senneth fic from Tayse's POV. hmm.). So there's an element of me not understanding Kirra -- not getting her motivation, not fundamentally knowing why she does the things she does.
The last quarter of the book drew in me in again, though. Justin as a puppy (XOMG flail), Berric's betrayal, the healing of Lyrie, the friendship between Kirra and Senneth, the friendship Kirra has with Justin and Cammon (I do kind of feel like Tayse is relegated to just being "Senneth's boyfriend" in this book, which makes me a little sad).
And then Belinda. Kirra's decision to heal her -- to do the right thing -- makes me love her after all; it makes me believe in her strength, after all.
Kirra burning the love for herself out of Romar's brain is one of the most painful scenes I've ever read. And I don't think she does the right thing there. She alters his mind without his permission, and nothing will make that okay (this shows up several times in Buffy, as well as in Doctor Who, and it pisses me off every time, so I admit to having a pre-existing bias). But being so far inside Kirra's head makes me understand why she does it, and I have sympathy for her in that moment. Overall, I can see that this will be better for Gillengaria, and will eventually be less wrong than continuing her affair with Romar (and I can see, by this point, that they'll never stop if they continue to love each other). But that doesn't make altering his mind without permission not wrong.
I feel terrible, because there's no course of action she could take that wouldn't make me pass some kind of moral judgment on her, and I absolutely hate putting characters in a double bind like that. But that's the brilliance of the writing, I guess. That's the fearlessness of the writing. Sometimes life is like that. Sometimes there isn't a good answer.
Then, the ending -- Donnal's return, and Kirra's hope, in spite of all the heartbreak -- is beautiful.
I certainly enjoyed it, but I didn't find it nearly as compelling as I did Mystic and Rider. I guess that's a given, really: I like Kirra, but she's not Senneth.
(Sidebar: right now, at least, I love Senneth more than any other character, ever. Clearly a reread -- or audio-book listen? -- of Mystic and Rider is in order, and then maybe I'll write more about her. But first I would like to read the third and fourth books, at least, so I know what else happens!)
I also don't find Romar Brendyn all that interesting, and for most of the book, I don't have a lot of sympathy for his and Kirra's star-crossed love. I'm intrigued by the other parts of the story -- Amalie and Valri are fascinating; so are Cammon and Justin. The political situation is fascinating, too, which is a testament to Shinn's writing ability (since I don't even care much about politics in real life, sadly). I miss Donnal's presence through most of the book -- both after he "leaves" and before, when he's there but Kirra's not paying attention to him -- but as a storytelling device, his absence is perfect.
Back to the romance angle: I spent the first part of the book thinking that maybe I just don't understand because I haven't been there; I've never met someone and fallen quickly and intensely in love despite Reasons for it not to work. I've been in love -- I think -- but it was a gradual thing that built from knowing someone for a long time and getting slowly closer. And I'm still not sure that's the in love that changes people's lives.
Once Kirra and Romar start sleeping together, there's some "I don't care about reputation/my wife/the fate of kingdom, I only want you," which made me angry at them both. In the background I was also thinking, "Maybe I don't want that -- ever. Maybe I wouldn't be cut out for this love thing."
Enter Tayse, telling Kirra that if she really loves Romar, her first priority should be to protect him, even if that means staying away from him.
Because, yeah, there are different ways of being in love. Different ways of expressing that love.
And I'm not a "be together at all costs" type; I'm a "look at the big picture, act for the greater good, suffer in silence if necessary" type (so possibly I can write Senneth fic from Tayse's POV. hmm.). So there's an element of me not understanding Kirra -- not getting her motivation, not fundamentally knowing why she does the things she does.
The last quarter of the book drew in me in again, though. Justin as a puppy (XOMG flail), Berric's betrayal, the healing of Lyrie, the friendship between Kirra and Senneth, the friendship Kirra has with Justin and Cammon (I do kind of feel like Tayse is relegated to just being "Senneth's boyfriend" in this book, which makes me a little sad).
And then Belinda. Kirra's decision to heal her -- to do the right thing -- makes me love her after all; it makes me believe in her strength, after all.
Kirra burning the love for herself out of Romar's brain is one of the most painful scenes I've ever read. And I don't think she does the right thing there. She alters his mind without his permission, and nothing will make that okay (this shows up several times in Buffy, as well as in Doctor Who, and it pisses me off every time, so I admit to having a pre-existing bias). But being so far inside Kirra's head makes me understand why she does it, and I have sympathy for her in that moment. Overall, I can see that this will be better for Gillengaria, and will eventually be less wrong than continuing her affair with Romar (and I can see, by this point, that they'll never stop if they continue to love each other). But that doesn't make altering his mind without permission not wrong.
I feel terrible, because there's no course of action she could take that wouldn't make me pass some kind of moral judgment on her, and I absolutely hate putting characters in a double bind like that. But that's the brilliance of the writing, I guess. That's the fearlessness of the writing. Sometimes life is like that. Sometimes there isn't a good answer.
Then, the ending -- Donnal's return, and Kirra's hope, in spite of all the heartbreak -- is beautiful.
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(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-11 06:22 pm (UTC)Justin was my favorite when I read this book (and puppy!Justin and lecturing!Justin make my heart squeal still), but Kirra has always been high on my list. I think see her learn the repercussions of love is fascinating - she's someone who's loved by all, but doesn't think about the cost of it.
I think in many ways my younger-self was a lot like Kirra. I was happy and flirty and found life and joy in everything, and it many ways it drew people to me. (er, usually guys, since all my friends were male. which, ah, caused love... octogons.) When I read the scene where Donnal left her, I set the book down and sobbed because there was a friend in my life who was that devoted to me, and he essentially did the same thing as Donnal. And I took him for granted until he was forced to detatch himself. In fact, a week later when he read the book, he emailed me to tell him how much that scene killed him. LOL.
But on the issue of whether love is so great to warrant Kirra's and Romar's behavior - I'm not able to empathize too much. I think being in Kirra's head so much is the only thing to make it work in the narrative. (I've been more repulsed by extramarital affairs in books before.)
And Kirra's altering his memory... egads, I hate that - not only because of the fact that she *does* it (because I'm with you on that), but that it so obviously crushes her to do so. I like that she's willing to carry all the pain, and let him go free in a way, but it's not the *right* thing to do.
This book personally tore me up in so many ways. I've changed a lot since I was like that, but it's still something that touches home - which is why even when I prefer other books more, this one is semi-sacred to me.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-12 01:14 am (UTC)(By the way, does Kirra remind you of Sandry? To me they seem very similar, so it's not surprising you love them both.)
I had to put the book down for a while after that scene, too. I don't think it made me cry, but it left me absolutely stunned. I come closer to understanding Donnal than I do Kirra (though I'm nowhere near as selfless -- which might be good), and I can't imagine leaving. (Of course, now, knowing that he didn't truly leave makes it all make sense to me.)
And I'm so sorry to hear about your friend, even if it was a while ago.
"This book personally tore me up in so many ways. I've changed a lot since I was like that, but it's still something that touches home - which is why even when I prefer other books more, this one is semi-sacred to me."
That's the best but sometimes the worst feeling to have about a book or a character, I think. *hugs*
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-12 02:43 am (UTC)That's unbelievably flattering. I hope Kirra wouldn't let all the guilt of her self-centeredness bring her down as much, though. ;)
(By the way, does Kirra remind you of Sandry? To me they seem very similar, so it's not surprising you love them both.)
You know, I would've never made the connection, but I can see where you're coming from. There's a certain boldness and self-assuredness they both possess (along with infinite bravery). I think Sandry has more goodness in her, and I think I ultimately love her more.
I had to put the book down for a while after that scene, too. I don't think it made me cry, but it left me absolutely stunned.
Ack, it was so hard to read. I think what made it difficult (for me, at least) was that unlike in my life, I could see all of Kirra's brashness and selfishness and all the ways she was accepting this love without giving anything in return, and I emphathized with Donnal. It rather hit me like a ton of bricks: you can't treat people this way and expect it to continue on without repercussions. Unlike me, Kirra got Donnal back. I was left with a fractured friendship. Maybe that's why the only fic I've written for Shinn is about this situation, about Donnal explaining why he was never truly gone.
Argh, didn't mean to turn this into my personal therapy session. >.<
*hugs* I'm hoping that you continue to enjoy the series. What I love about Shinn (well, one of *many* things) is that her heroes and heroines often do things that I'm not fond of, but it kind of makes them feel more real to me. And at the end of the day, I can't completely blame them because - as you said above - there was no way to make it through without some negative moral judgment.
Oh! And going up to what you said in your original post... I see what you mean about Tayse being there as a Senneth-attachment rather than for himself. Unfortunately with Senneth as the special sauce on this awesome-burger, it definitely feels that way sometimes. Justin's narration is next though, so if I recall correctly, there's some OMGTAYSE hero-worship for who Tayse is. ;)
(let me know if you'd like me to send you my copies, if you can't find them at a library or bookstore.)
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-12 03:08 am (UTC)OMGTAYSE I CAN HAS FATHER NAO?
Why yes. There is a lot of that. And it makes me tear up. Which is actually hard to do for me in Darkmoon Defender because by GOD there is a lot of Epic. Romance. But Tayse and Justin have moments where they stand seperate from all that, and it is glorious.
Here ends my next-book recommendation.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-13 01:44 am (UTC)On further consideration, I'm taking a bit of break before Darkmoon Defender. But one way or another, I'm sure you'll see me blathering about it when I get there.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-13 01:57 am (UTC)Oh, sweetie, the little smiley won't stop me from pointing out that you are an amazingly kind and generous friend to so many people. I sincerely hope you can move past whatever guilt you're dealing with. *smushes*
Argh, didn't mean to turn this into my personal therapy session. >.<
'S ok... you've been on the receiving end of my little freak-outs often enough. And I do find it truly interesting to hear what all this means you! (Partly, too, it's nice to know I'm not the only one who sometimes gets deeply emotionally involved with characters/stories she identifies with.)
Oh! And going up to what you said in your original post... I see what you mean about Tayse being there as a Senneth-attachment rather than for himself. Unfortunately with Senneth as the special sauce on this awesome-burger, it definitely feels that way sometimes. Justin's narration is next though, so if I recall correctly, there's some OMGTAYSE hero-worship for who Tayse is. ;)
1. It's not that it doesn't make sense, since I can see Kirra seeing him that way. But it's nice to know he gets some good moments in the next one.
2. *sporfle* "Senneth as the special sauce on this awesome-burger." Um. I'm trying not to look too closely at that analogy, but it's cracking me up anyway.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-12 09:48 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-13 01:42 am (UTC)